Reachback and turning away timing in the X Step.

[RowingBoats]

Replace reach back with walking around the disc.

I think this is better, but to me it still implies a disconnected concept. This could be totally personal because I see exactly what 'walk around the disc' means when I look at other people, but the actual feeling when I do it makes this a bi-product of why it happens, not a goal.

 

[RoDeO]

I've tried everything under the sun and have finally settled on a means to get into my reachback and feel all the timing sequences and when I pull the disc through it feels very powerful on distance shots. Yet, on short holes that changes slightly and I notice I delay some and don't reach back as far or as soon.

I think the important part for distance is that a person needs to ere on the side of too much rather than not enough and be more deliberate and methodical to really channel up leverage and power. I think reaching back too late hurts one's distance potential.

 

[seedlings]

I've tried everything under the sun and have finally settled on a means to get into my reachback and feel all the timing sequences and when I pull the disc through it feels very powerful on distance shots. Yet, on short holes that changes slightly and I notice I delay some and don't reach back as far or as soon.

I think the important part for distance is that a person needs to ere on the side of too much rather than not enough and be more deliberate and methodical to really channel up leverage and power. I think reaching back too late hurts one's distance potential.

What felt wrong when you tried the quick, athletic reachback timed with the lead leg?

 

[RoDeO]

What felt wrong when you tried the quick, athletic reachback timed with the lead leg?

Nothing feels wrong, it's just a controlled shot and won't go as far. Certainly don't feel like there's a deep well of power to draw from like I get with the later turn and reachback. It's a literal night and day difference in power and how the disc ejects between the two different approaches. I just feel like I'm not able to stretch and draw power as deeply from the late turn and reachback. I saw a video someone posted of Paul Oman and how he has this slow methodical reachback and turns quite a ways in the backswing. I took some of that approach with how much he turns backwards and since then my gains have been very substantial.

 

[oldmandiscer]

Left foot hits then shoulder rotation. I would watch what they do instead of trying to do your own thing.

 

[twistedraven]

Let's see what Ezra has to say about turning around too early:


"It's really not a powerful position to be in because you have to move your hips all the way around to the target."

 

[RoDeO]

What felt wrong when you tried the quick, athletic reachback timed with the lead leg?

Let's see what Ezra has to say about turning around too early:


"It's really not a powerful position to be in because you have to move your hips all the way around to the target."

So what about the guys who do the 360 distance throws? They have to bring their hips from all the way around. Don't those guys hold the distance records? I don't think moving the hips all the way around to the target is a problem. That's just another myth.

 

[RowingBoats]

So what about the guys who do the 360 distance throws? They have to bring their hips from all the way around. Don't those guys hold the distance records? I don't think moving the hips all the way around to the target is a problem. That's just another myth.

Where do you think the disc is being thrown in your video?

 

[RandyC]

So what about the guys who do the 360 distance throws? They have to bring their hips from all the way around. Don't those guys hold the distance records? I don't think moving the hips all the way around to the target is a problem. That's just another myth.

There is that little hop in 360 which enables you to get your hips into that powerful position.

 

[RoDeO]

Where do you think the disc is being thrown in your video?

I'm not sure I understand what you are saying but Lizotte in his 360 throw definitely has to go from a full 180 degrees at his reachback from backwards into release.

 

[seedlings]

What felt wrong when you tried the quick, athletic reachback timed with the lead leg?

Nothing feels wrong, it's just a controlled shot and won't go as far. Certainly don't feel like there's a deep well of power to draw from like I get with the later turn and reachback. It's a literal night and day difference in power and how the disc ejects between the two different approaches. I just feel like I'm not able to stretch and draw power as deeply from the late turn and reachback. I saw a video someone posted of Paul Oman and how he has this slow methodical reachback and turns quite a ways in the backswing. I took some of that approach with how much he turns backwards and since then my gains have been very substantial.

It's a shame you didn't put forth more effort into that form. Sounds like you took the lazy form.

 

[twistedraven]

In the 360, they hop into the traditional staggered stance with strong brace. For a brief moment in time, both of the feet are off the ground when the body is backwards and the butt is facing the target. Clearly, they are not trying to initiate the throw at this point in time.

In his 360 tutorial video, Simon also talks about the importance of not reaching back too early with a straight arm, as you're losing the pendulum effect from the elbow.

 

[RoDeO]

It's a shame you didn't put forth more effort into that form. Sounds like you took the lazy form.

No not at all. There just isn't as much power potential from that type of shot.

 

[SaROCaM]

No not at all. There just isn't as much power potential from that type of shot.

This is a myth.

 

[RoDeO]

This is a myth.

Then why do top throwers turn back more and sooner for max distance shots?

 

[RowingBoats]

I'm not sure I understand what you are saying but Lizotte in his 360 throw definitely has to go from a full 180 degrees at his reachback from backwards into release.

Ya, I have not looked into the 360 much at all, so I was mistaken in what I thought I was seeing. After looking at some 360's and trying to apply it to what I have learned in my own practice, I can see how when he lands from the actual jump, he returns to a position that is similar to a standard x-step.

Once he lands he does the same type of timed backswing seen in any good drive technique. He isn't lingering backwards, and trying to apply what is seen in this video to a slow, standard x-step doesn't compute.

 

[RoDeO]

Ya, I have not looked into the 360 much at all, so I was mistaken in what I thought I was seeing. After looking at some 360's and trying to apply it to what I have learned in my own practice, I can see how when he lands from the actual jump, he returns to a position that is similar to a standard x-step.

Once he lands he does the same type of timed backswing seen in any good drive technique. He isn't lingering backwards, and trying to apply what is seen in this video to a slow, standard x-step doesn't compute.

Of note though, he does come from a more rearward position. I think it's about creating a greater leverage.

 

[SaROCaM]

Then why do top throwers turn back more and sooner for max distance shots?

You seem to be mixing different parameters.

Also it seems your position on form has changed.

 

[LATTLAYFOTTFOY]

Can we please just let Rodeo get to to his point of saying that you should just back pedal into the brace! Which you should not do by the way! Just do a 360 on every throw Rodeo and you will get maximum distance off the tee if that is truly what your heart desires... who cares when you turn back go try for yourself and experiment when to turn back instead of saying you should turn back here or there. Different people can turn and start to leverage their shot at different times based on the way they intend to throw. Again go out and try these ways you think you will throw better and post your progress. If you are superior in your way of thinking than show it. Your bs on fighting everyone in every thread is old as can be. Last time I'll be posting here so say what you want. Proof is in the pudding Rodeo!

 

[RoDeO]

Can we please just let Rodeo get to to his point of saying that you should just back pedal into the brace! Which you should not do by the way! Just do a 360 on every throw Rodeo and you will get maximum distance off the tee if that is truly what your heart desires... who cares when you turn back go try for yourself and experiment when to turn back instead of saying you should turn back here or there. Different people can turn and start to leverage their shot at different times based on the way they intend to throw. Again go out and try these ways you think you will throw better and post your progress. If you are superior in your way of thinking than show it. Your bs on fighting everyone in every thread is old as can be. Last time I'll be posting here so say what you want. Proof is in the pudding Rodeo!

Backpedal is relative. In one sense, almost all distance competition competitors are backpedaling in some degree.

I think people should develop their own style and experiment and find what works. In my own journey I have found that my distance increased as I turned more. I give up some control but the gain in distance is substantial.